Nathan W. Bingham’s Microblog

Dr. James R. White came to Australia in August 2009 for several engagements in both Sydney and Brisbane. This provided an opportunity to request an interview with him. Graciously, he agreed, and below is the interview I conducted with him.

1. In your apologetics ministry, I believe one of your most distinguishing marks is that of your preparation. Frustratingly, this is often highlighted by just how unprepared your debating opponents appear to be. Could you give the readers an insight into how you go about preparing for a debate?

I appreciate the compliment in the question. I do attempt to be prepared, and, as long as I have the opportunity to study my opponent’s position, I will do so. I spent months listening to John Dominic Crossan, Marcus Borg, John Shelby Spong, Bart Ehrman, and Shabir Ally, before engaging in debate with them. I think this is necessary to honor God, the audience, and the opponent. But I cannot always do that since I at times debate men who have not lectured or written on the topics of our debate. But I always seek to provide something that will help believers in the future, and it is keeping that forward looking perspective that forces me to do the work that goes into serious preparation.

2. The merit of Christians participating in public moderated debates with Christians from differing denominations is questioned by some. However, for pastors considering such a debate, would you encourage them to pursue these opportunities, and what (if any) benefit do you believe such debates bring to a pastor’s congregation?

In the 17th century in England a ministerial student had to be able to debate in Greek by his junior year. In Greek, not about Greek. There are few more efficient ways for two theological positions to be fairly presented, contrasted, and evaluated in the light of Scripture, than in formal, respectful, biblically-based debate. Only in our post-modern society where people are deathly afraid of “offense” has this valuable tool become nearly obsolete.

3. Christians skilled in apologetics and trained in the Word are sadly lacking in much of the church. What role do you believe apologetics should play within the church, and specifically how does a local church go about training Christians in this area?

In the West we are living in a post-Christian society that is madly in love with anything that can be used to support unbelief. The days of innocent Christian believers who never dirty their hands with the arguments against the faith have passed us by. If we want to be at all active in the proclamation of the gospel we must prepare the ground which has been sown deeply in the weeds of noxious unbelief. Apologetics is no longer an “add on” that some “super Christians” might wish to study, it is now part and parcel of any serious effort at speaking the truth in love in our society.

4. Knowledge of the Scriptures in general is extremely important; however, for the specific benefit of one who may aspire to be an apologist, which specific biblical texts and/or books of the Bible would you suggest they study and have a firm working knowledge of?

We cannot divide the revelation of God up into parts, some of which are “more important” than others. The apologist must have a full knowledge of the Bible, including its over-arching themes and threads that tie the entire revelation together. I have often been asked what classes I took in college and seminary were the most useful to my work as an apologist, and I always respond, “Greek and Church History.” The believer who knows the Bible as a whole, in a balanced way, has access to the original languages, and knows the outlines of church history, will be ready for 90% of what unbelievers will throw out as objections to Christianity.

5. The training and discipline in God’s Word that a seminary offers is invaluable; however, what would you consider to be the greatest lesson you’ve learned in your practical ministry that seminary did not teach you?

I am very thankful that I was already involved in ministry before I entered seminary. I already had an idea of the “real world” and the need to be grounded in the local church. I never fell for the “ivory tower” part of a seminary education where extremely wise people sit around debating how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. I already knew what I needed to get out of my schooling, so I focused on the main and plain things. This included many of the classes that others could barely stand, such as “New Testament Backgrounds,” a class that has allowed me to refute critics of Christianity over and over again.

I have learned many things that seminary did not teach me, but if I had to mention one, I would say that the centrality of the church, and ministry therein, was not a major portion of at least my initial seminary training. I am a churchman, and it is that consistent ministry in the church that has kept me from spinning off into the stranger elements of theological speculation.

6. Several weeks ago, some would say that a truly amazing event occurred; you joined the Twitter world (@DrOakley1689). As one with ministry experience in blogging, using IRC, and publishing videos via YouTube, do you have any thoughts / observations specifically related to Twitter and Christian ministry?

Honestly, no! I only began doing it so as to share random theological thoughts that would often come to me during the day but would never make it to my blog. A program on my BlackBerry Storm (Vlingo) allows me to send something directly to Twitter without even typing it out. However, I must admit, it was great to make some connections via Twitter that I would not have otherwise made, ministerially speaking, so it has its uses.

7. This year, like every year, there are many young men completing their studies and preparing to enter the ministry. If you knew your answer to this question would be your final parting words to them, what book, other than the Bible or anything you may have published, would you recommend they read as it has had such a profound effect on you and your ministry?

I would say I would encourage them all to read and ponder Sproul’s The Holiness of God. The man who has a handle on the holiness of God (and hence his own sinfulness) stands upon firm ground in withstanding the winds of difficulty in the ministry. As to final parting words, “Stand firm, hold fast, act like men, find in your service to Christ your greatest treasure, love God and His truth supremely.”

8. Directing your answer to those who are hungry to know the Word better, as well as to men training to minister the Word of God; what “must have” items would you recommend for them to purchase to build their library (commentaries, systematic theologies, lexicons, Hebrew / Greek texts, etc.)?

We live in a day when we have access to more useful information about the Bible and its text than any preceding generation. In fact, we are in danger of the “data fog,” there is so much out there. But I have found the consistent exegesis of the text to be the greatest “weapon” in my arsenal, and the means by which I show God honor by allowing His Word to speak (rather than my inserting my thoughts into His mouth through eisegesis). And while I have a pretty healthy paper library, BibleWorks and the Libronix system from Logos run on my computer most of the time. Both have their strengths, as I prefer BibleWorks for exegesis, and Logos for doing reading in commentaries, journal articles, etc. I also have the Kindle2 from Amazon, which allows for much lower-priced copies of certain books in the theological field.

As to books, I will limit myself to the textual field. I have highly recommended the NET/NA27 diglott to folks, as it contains a wealth of textual and translational information. Likewise, Philip Comfort’s New Testament Text and Translation Commentary is one of the most useful resources a minister could have in dealing with textual issues in sermon preparation and study.

9. Could you comment on 2 Peter 3:9 and 1 Timothy 2:4; specifically Peter’s use of the Greek boulomai (“wishing”) in contrast with Paul’s use of the Greek thelo (“desires”) and how this relates (if at all) to God’s will(s) and desire(s).

See my comments on these texts in The Potter’s Freedom. I dedicated an entire chapter to “the Big Three” texts, Matthew 23:37, 1 Timothy 2:4, and 2 Peter 3:9.

10. Why is the atonement an important doctrine and in your opinion what are the present threats to understanding this doctrine correctly?

The majority of evangelicals in my experience hold a sentimental view of the atonement rather than a biblical one. Given that a large portion of the specifically exegetical discussion of the subject is found in the one book of the New Testament that is “closed” to most modern believers (Hebrews, and that due to its dependence upon the Old Testament scriptures, with which many of us today have but a surface level familiarity), they are more likely to embrace a sentimental/traditional understanding of the work of Christ than a biblical one. And since the categories found in Scripture relate to priesthood, mediation, etc., concepts foreign to most today, there is a grave danger of a general acceptance of a sub-biblical, surface-level view. And since this is the act whereby God glorifies Himself in the greatest fashion, misunderstanding here cannot help but have a ripple effect across the spectrum of one’s theological
beliefs.

11. One source states that “Islam is the fastest growing religion and the second largest religion in the world” with growth of “over 235 percent in the last fifty years.” How should the church and Christians in general respond to such statistics?

Well, with understanding, first. Almost every group I deal with makes such claims. There are many Muslims coming to know Christ. That’s a fact. At the same time, how do you determine a “real” Muslim from a cultural one? Many Muslims are so merely out of tradition, just “going with the flow” so to speak. So while Islamic expansion is a reality that must be dealt with, at the same time we need to be realistic. It is true that, for example, Muslim immigrants in France are having 4.56 children/woman in comparison with the native French population only have 1.5. However, the second generation is only having half as many children, as they become culturally impacted. So we need to be concerned, yes, but we need to be realistic as well.

12. During your stay in Australia, is it your intention to try the famous Australian spread Vegemite?

No, I want only pleasant memories of my time Down Under. :-)

Dr. James R. White, thank you for your ministry and for agreeing to take part in this interview. I trust the Lord will bless your time in Australia.

Soli Deo Gloria,

Nathan W. Bingham

Dr. J. Ligon Duncan III came to Australia in April 2009 as the guest speaker for the 150th Anniversary of the Presbyterian Church of Victoria. This provided an opportunity to request an interview with him. Graciously, he agreed, and below is the interview I conducted with him.

1. Interest in Reformed theology, or more specifically the ‘Five Points of Calvinism’, has experienced a lot of growth recently, especially amongst young people. What can these young people (or new converts to the ‘Five Points’) learn from the more established Reformed churches?

What is being called “the young, reformed, awakening” (not only by in-house evangelical organs like Christianity Today but also by the mainstream media, for instance Time magazine) is real. I meet it everywhere I go. But it is especially exploding in contexts were theology has been most anemic. Young people are encountering truth that the Reformed and confessional churches have long treasured (but have perhaps of late taken for granted and downplayed), but the old theology is being mediated to them by figures that do not represent the older reformed bodies of faith. Mark Driscoll, John Piper, C.J. Mahaney, John MacArthur, Al Mohler, each in very different ways, have served as major transmitters of Reformed theology to a new generation. The only major figure from an old-line presbyterian and reformed denominational tradition who has their level of name-recognition and reach is R.C. Sproul. To R.C. must be added the name of J.I. Packer, a confessionally reformed Anglican.

What can young people attracted by this faithful presentation of a big God, with huge grace, deep truth and strong love learn from the older confessional communions? In a word, ecclesiology (how the Bible says that we are be and what we are to do together as the people of God, that is, how we are to live and minister in the Christian community and in the world). The doctrine of the church has long been a lacuna in evangelicalism, and it is no different now, even among those attracted afresh to the doctrines of grace. And without confessional commitments and a biblical theology of the church, the awakening won’t amount to much in the long run.

2. Following on from the previous question: there are those today that would say that it is too narrow to view Reformed theology as simply the ‘Five Points of Calvinism,’ and that what is often promoted today under the name ‘New Calvinism’ has no place in associating itself with historic Calvinism or Reformed theology. Firstly, what are your thoughts on whether ‘New Calvinism’ is historically Reformed, and secondly, do you think its influence (if any) will be positive or negative for the next 150 years of Presbyterianism in Australia and the United States?

Well, yes, of course, being Reformed means much more than “the five points of Calvinism” and no, much of the “New Calvinism” is not historically Reformed in a confessional sense. But I’m thrilled that young folk are open and even attracted to the doctrines of grace and the sovereignty of God. And I think we who are part of historic confessional Reformed churches ought to thank God for what he is doing and indeed for the new opportunity that he has given us in this awakening. Because it does, I think, open the door for the confessional Reformed community to reach it out with a more comprehensive biblical theology of the life and ministry of the church.

I often tell my presbyterian friends that as I am out and among the “young, restless and reformed” types, I feel as if I’m meeting people who are rummaging through our bins and pulling out things we have thrown away and saying “Isn’t this glorious?” By that I mean that we are sometimes can be indifferent about truths that are an important part of our theological legacy, truths that this generation finds electrifying and attractive.

Walk among young Reformed, presbyterian ministers in the States and you’ll find many of them excited about “re-thinking how we do church” but a lot of them won’t be excited about Reformed soteriology. I think this is a mistake on our part when we fail to appreciate and celebrate biblical truth that is a significant part of our confessional heritage, especially when so many out there are showing an interest in these very truths.

As to what the influence of the new Calvinism will be in the next 150 years, I’d say (again) that unless the new Calvinists adopt a biblical ecclesiology, the influence of the movement will not continue long.

3. The training and discipline in God’s Word that a seminary offers is invaluable; however, what would you say is the greatest lesson you have learned in ministry that seminary did not teach you?

I am a strong supporter of traditional seminary theological education (having taught in seminary for about twenty years now), but when it comes to ministry there is no better school than experience. That takes nothing away from seminary. Experience can’t teach you Hebrew and Christology! We need good seminaries.

So, what have I learned in ministry that I didn’t learn in seminary? Well, for one thing, (by ministering and making mistakes myself, and by watching ministers and ministries for twenty-five years) I have learned that the way you give leadership in a local congregation is often the most important determining factor in your reception by and duration in the church. A man’s ministry of the word can be compromised and even ruined by the way he relates to his elders and other church leaders, by the way he articulates vision and by the manner in which he moves the church forward.

Personally, I don’t think leadership can be taught (I think you either have it or you don’t), but I also think that treating people with courtesy, honesty, deference, and humility; that leading by persuasion and not force of will; that being willing to lose a session vote graciously and to not always get one’s way; that cultivating strong, healthy, Gospel relationships with church leaders and fellow workers; and that establishing a work ethic that garners the respect of one’s peers, are all part of a kind of leadership that bodes well for healthy congregational life and ministry.

4. Some ministry leaders share a common frustration; their congregation and/or those in their Bible study express a desire verbally to read God’s Word and pray; yet, they confess that they just never get around to it complaining they are too busy. What advice would you give someone who is desperately trying to convince those Christians under their guidance as to the importance of studying God’s Word and of prayer?

First, be patient. Second, preach the word from the pulpit with fervency, clarity and power, and let the prime means of grace do its work. Third, emphasize the importance of a weekly prayer meeting. Fourth, invite a core group of potential leaders in the congregation to study the Bible and pray with you, weekly and personally. Meet as a small group and do a Bible survey, and lead them in prayer. Model for them how to do it. Make them take part and be active participants. Watch the contagion spread among them for the study of God’s word and prayer in the church, homes and their personal lives. Let them become recruiters and encouragers of others to study the word and pray for themselves. Fifth, in the course of your teaching/preaching the Bible in the local church, spend time explicitly and specifically on explaining why it is important for Christians to study the word and to pray, and how one ought to do it. Sixth, get your people to read good books about Bible study and prayer (John Blanchard, “How to Enjoy Your Bible,” Don Carson, “A Call to Spiritual Reformation,” Matthew Henry, “Method For Prayer,” “Ryken’s Bible Handbook,” etc).

5. This year, like every year, there are many young men completing their studies and preparing to enter the ministry. If you knew your answer to this question would be your final parting words to them, what book, other than the Bible or anything you may have published, would you recommend they read as it has personally had such a profound effect on you and your ministry?

J.I. Packer’s “A Quest for Godliness” is a goldmine that I’ve read repeatedly. It’s subtitled something like “The Puritan Vision of the Christian Life.” It has had a profound effect on my philosophy of ministry. Thomas Brooks’ “Precious Remedies Against Satan’s Devices” taught me more about applying the word than any homiletics text I’d ever read. It also fed my soul and helped me to feed others’. David Wells’ “No Place for Truth” (and its four sequels) are the best theological sociological analysis of the evangelical church in our time. Mark Dever’s “Nine Marks of a Healthy Church” is an excellent guide to young pastors on how to go about revitalizing a local congregation or planting a healthy new one. Of the books I’ve written or edited, I would suggest “Give Praise to God” (in part because many others participated in writing it, who have a lot more to say than I do!), but I think it’s content and topic are important for ministry today.

6. 150-years of Presbyterianism in Victoria is something to be extremely thankful to God for. If you knew your answer to this question would be your final parting words to those presently in the pulpit, and to the future ministers in the Presbyterian church; what one thing would you strongly encourage these men to affirm from the pulpit and/or in their ministry in general, and what one thing would you strongly encourage them to deny from the pulpit and/or in their ministry in general, to help ensure the next 150-years of Presbyterianism?

Affirm the authority of the Word, the sovereignty of God, the sinfulness of humans, the complete sufficiency of Christ’s substituionary atonement, salvation by grace alone, through faith alone in Christ alone, complementarianism and a biblical doctrine of the church.

Deny both legalism and antinomianism, deny all low views of Scripture, anti-confessionalism, political correctness, egalitarianism, cynicism, pragmatism, individualism and syncretism.

Meanwhile – Preach the Word. Love your flock. Pray with passion. Disciple your elders. Promote family religion. Live a godly life. Do not waver in your confessional doctrinal commitments.

7. It is no secret that you’re on Twitter and Facebook. In fact, it was because of ’social media’ that we were able to make contact and conduct this interview. What benefit do you see ’social media’ bringing to Reformed / Presbyterian ministry, and what dangers do you think need to be guarded against?

Social media can be a huge waste of time, and broadcast triviality and narcissism. I ruthlessly monitor my time (and thus have to ignore a lot of requests and messages). On the other hand, social media provide a great way to connect with, keep up on and follow old and new friends (especially when they live at a distance). They can also strategically serve as strategic teaching opportunities and instruments of influence.

8. Following on from the last question: are you a fan of the TeamPyro blog, and could you provide your top-5 TeamPyro posts? Furthermore, if you were going to give advice to a busy Minister who wanted to start reading blogs, please list your top-5 must reads.

There are too many great TeamPyro posts to begin to list, so I check on the “Fab 3½” (Phil, Dan and Frank, plus the elusive, random and very occasional Peccadillo) every day!

Busy ministers should check Between Two Worlds (Justin Taylor), Al Mohler, ref21, Arts and Letters Daily, and 9Marks.

9. You will be speaking at this year’s Gospel Coalition National Conference. Joining together to proclaim the essentials of the gospel is an important endeavor; however, given the recent surge in more cross-denominational gospel events, do you think there is a chance the denominational distinctives, which each denomination believes to be Biblically based, are at risk of fading into the background and/or being replaced by the doctrinal distinctives of the loudest or most ‘popular’ speaker/s at such events? If you agree; what suggestions do you have to ensure this doesn’t occur?

Yes, I think that there is a very real risk right now of denominational distinctives being downplayed, or fading, or being replaced. Partly, this is because evangelicalism is increasingly “post-denominational” especially at the level of the local church. One thing this means is that members do not feel especially tied to denominations or denominational distinctives, and this in turn tempts ministers and church leaders to be indifferent to those distinctives in the name of church growth.

I think this indifference is a huge mistake. One of the things we have tried to say loudly through the Alliance of Confessing Evangelicals and Together for the Gospel is that our unity is in the truth, even on points where we differ. What we mean by that its that we all care deeply about the truth, we are united about the central truths of the Gospel, and we think our distinctives are important, even and especially where we differ from one another in our views.

In other words, we are united around, not “mission plus a doctrinal minimalism” but rather around doctrinal maximalism (within which we will rigorously and respectfully both agree and disagree, all the while promoting a robust confessionalism) and the Gospel message and biblical means.

10. Following on from the previous question: when you’re at such events as the Gospel Coalition National Conference and you consider such things as Presbyterianism’s historic longevity, is there anything you consider unique to Presbyterianism that can to some degree account for its longevity, and/or makes you thankful that you are Presbyterian?

Presbyterianism is now half a millennium old and there are more non-English speaking presbyterians than there are English-speaking presbyterians. Conservative, Bible-believing presbyterian churches are growing, even in parts of the world and culture where other churches are declining and dying. The leadership of world presbyterianism is more conservative theologically and more evangelical than it was fifty years a ago. All of the credit for this goes to God. He alone is responsible for the continuing existence of evangelical presbyterianism.

What factors have contributed to the longevity of presbyterianism? One, it’s commitment to both biblical theology and biblical polity. Presbyterianism began as a renewal movement focused on seeing the church rooted in biblical doctrine, worship, discipline and government. Two, presbyterianism has simultaneously fostered a deep biblical piety and a love for learning, so that education and devotion go hand in hand. Third, presbyterianism, through its adherents, has always been deeply and extensively engaged in the communities in which it existed, and thus provided cultural leadership.

I am thankful for all these things, and trust the Lord will be pleased to use them for his own glory.

11. A common and insightful question that is often asked of Ministers is how they prepare for their Lord’s Day sermon each week. Here is a slight twist on that question. Given the historic nature of your time in Australia, and given that the messages you deliver will be remembered and documented for many years to come, how did you go about preparing for what you would share at the Thanksgiving Service and the Ministry Conference?

Dr. Allan Harman (a long-time friend and colleague) and I began talking many months ago about what topics I should address and what themes I ought to emphasize. I relied on Dr. Harman’s knowledge of the Australian scene to inform me of the context into which I would be preaching and then simply asked the question: “How can I best serve these brethren?” What could I bring to them that would be most helpful and encouraging, given their context and challenges and opportunities? Allan and I looked over some topics that I’ve covered at ministerial conferences over the last several years and we landed on several specific ideas that we thought would be timely and edifying for those gathered at these special meetings. I then began reading Australian history and Australian Presbyterian history to give me even more perspective on the situation here.

So, I ended up addressing ministers about prayer, the atonement and Old Testament narrative. I addressed the 150th service on “The Goal of Our Ministry: Big Grace and Deep Truth for Strong Love,” from 1 Timothy 1:1-5. Then I preached on “repentance” and the significance of Jesus’ baptism for us (from Luke 3) on Sunday in the churches, morning and evening.

Dr. J. Ligon Duncan III, thank you for edifying the Body of Christ in Australia, and thank you for taking the time to participate in this interview.

Soli Deo Gloria,

Nathan W. Bingham.